Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

The long and short stories of 'The Last War' by Jan Niemczyk and others
Bernard Woolley
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Bernard Woolley »

Yup, logistics.
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James1978
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by James1978 »

Johnnie Lyle wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:08 pm
James1978 wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:59 pm
Bernard Woolley wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 2:30 am No, there are no mixed battalions in peacetime. Panzer battalions have 44 Leopard 2s, Panzergrenadier battalions have 44 Marder 2s.
Any particular reason the mixed battalions went away in TLWverse? Every @1989 ORBAT I've seen has them.
Probably for the same reasons we don’t have many mixed battalions in other armies in peacetime - savings on the logistical, maintenance and training sides.
Maybe not currently, but a number of NATO armies were doing it during the 1980s.
Johnnie Lyle
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Johnnie Lyle »

James1978 wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:24 pm
Johnnie Lyle wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:08 pm
James1978 wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:59 pm Any particular reason the mixed battalions went away in TLWverse? Every @1989 ORBAT I've seen has them.
Probably for the same reasons we don’t have many mixed battalions in other armies in peacetime - savings on the logistical, maintenance and training sides.
Maybe not currently, but a number of NATO armies were doing it during the 1980s.
And it’s not unreasonable they would have gone back to pure battalions to save money, even if it makes combat integration more difficult.
Jotun
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Jotun »

James1978 wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:56 pm Jotun, are you going to draft some FRG TOEs for us? Heersstruktur 6?

Related question for Jotun, how would FRG demographics impact TLW 2005 force structure as compared to @1989?
There are enough crises around the TLW world that there are going to be quite a lot of immigrants who can he drafted as soon as they are citizens.
I think that‘s enough handwavium :mrgreen:
Seriously, the topic is too complex to deal with in a few posts.
Bernard Woolley
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Bernard Woolley »

This?
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Jotun
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Jotun »

Nope. Citizenship means service.
Bernard Woolley
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Bernard Woolley »

:lol:
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Eaglenine2
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Eaglenine2 »

Wasn't there a Infantry man assigned to a Cuirassiers regiment granted that a French Armored Squadron has access to protection platoon mounted in VAB.
French mechanized infantry formation of 1989 had access to a armored company.
Johnnie Lyle
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Johnnie Lyle »

Jotun wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 7:01 pm Nope. Citizenship means service.
¿Por qué no los dos?
James1978
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by James1978 »

Eaglenine2 wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 8:57 pm Wasn't there a Infantry man assigned to a Cuirassiers regiment granted that a French Armored Squadron has access to protection platoon mounted in VAB.
French mechanized infantry formation of 1989 had access to a armored company.
Well, that's the French Army . . .

But yes, French armored battalions have three tank and one mech infantry company. Mech infantry battalions are three mech infantry and one tank company.
Bernard Woolley
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Bernard Woolley »

The French just like being French.
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Bernard Woolley
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Bernard Woolley »

Have added the TerritorialHeer and CINCENT Reserve.
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Jotun
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Jotun »

Bernard Woolley wrote: Wed Dec 28, 2022 8:33 pm Have added the TerritorialHeer and CINCENT Reserve.
You chose the Marder 2 in its 50mm gun configuration as the Jaguar 2 replacement? Interesting, I like it. Do the pure AT Marders have an additional missile load instead of the squad of Panzergrenadiers in the back?
How many Karakal vehicles are in service?

Oh, and did you get my single comment on the Territorial Commands‘ role as a corps HQ?
Eaglenine2
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Eaglenine2 »

Question what is the war time mission of Centre d'entraînement commando?
Bernard Woolley
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Bernard Woolley »

Jotun wrote: Wed Dec 28, 2022 10:36 pm You chose the Marder 2 in its 50mm gun configuration as the Jaguar 2 replacement? Interesting, I like it. Do the pure AT Marders have an additional missile load instead of the squad of Panzergrenadiers in the back?
How many Karakal vehicles are in service?
Was just something that came to me. Use the 50mm version and add TOW-2 from surplus Jaguar 2s. In the long-term, TOW would be replaced by Spike-ER. Yes, they would have additional missiles in the back.
Haven’t really thought about the Karakal.
Jotun wrote: Wed Dec 28, 2022 10:36 pm Oh, and did you get my single comment on the Territorial Commands‘ role as a corps HQ?
I did. Good suggestion.
“Frankly, I had enjoyed the war… and why do people want peace if the war is so much fun?” - Lieutenant General Sir Adrian Carton de Wiart
Jotun
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Jotun »

Bernard Woolley wrote: Thu Dec 29, 2022 1:43 am
Jotun wrote: Wed Dec 28, 2022 10:36 pm You chose the Marder 2 in its 50mm gun configuration as the Jaguar 2 replacement? Interesting, I like it. Do the pure AT Marders have an additional missile load instead of the squad of Panzergrenadiers in the back?
How many Karakal vehicles are in service?
Was just something that came to me. Use the 50mm version and add TOW-2 from surplus Jaguar 2s. In the long-term, TOW would be replaced by Spike-ER. Yes, they would have additional missiles in the back.
Haven’t really thought about the Karakal.
Jotun wrote: Wed Dec 28, 2022 10:36 pm Oh, and did you get my single comment on the Territorial Commands‘ role as a corps HQ?
I did. Good suggestion.
Regarding the Karakal, maybe a few companies' worth in the AA regiments of the first-line divisions? Like, one or two max per regiment? AFAIR, we worked out that Karakal was in the process of being introduced…
Bernard Woolley
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Bernard Woolley »

Would make sense.
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Matt Wiser
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Matt Wiser »

Where's 4th ID? Shouldn't they be part of V Corps?
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Bernard Woolley
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Bernard Woolley »

:oops:

EDIT: Fixed.
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Jotun
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Re: Order of Battle Allied Forces Central Region (ground)

Post by Jotun »

Another thing that (finally) got my attention:
Frontnachrichtenkompanie is not a Front News Company but rather a Front Intelligence Company (HUMINT). Their job was to gain fresh intelligence from new POWs, especially from vital branches of the WP armies and of course officers, the higher ranking the better. They were hunting for information about dislocation of troops, the logistics situation, morale etc.
Thr means of gathering intelligence were solely by interviewing and applied communication psychology.

"Nachrichten" has two meanings. One is simply "news“, the other is "intelligence". The German word for intelligence service is "Nachrichtendienst", for example, as best evidenced by the long title of the BND, Bundesnachrichtendienst.
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